Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince:

[avadakedavra]

Because of all the snape discussion, figured I'd put this up. Scanned from latest Entertainment Weekly, so if anyone wants to pick the whole thing up, it has Harry on the cover (obviously).

All the scans can be found at danradcliffe.com. This is just a clip of one of the pages.

[Capt Snow]

Woah , After reading all of that, I wouldn't even know where to begin. You guys know quite a lot about this stuff, I feel like a complete novice.

Regardless of how much I know of backstory, I am somewhat adept at picking things up. I do think as well that Snape was indeed following orders much as Harry was made to do inside the cave. Knowing that his exposure as an Ally of Dumbledore, could infavorably tip the scales in Voldemorts favor. Snape has a uniquely advantageous position being able to infiltrate Voldemorts circle, and provides obviously important information to the OotP. Dumbledore recognized this, which is why I think it isn't out of the question for Dumbledore to have sacrificed his life at the hands of Snape, if he thought it would bring and end to Voldemort. I do remember quite often within the last few chapters of the book, Dumbledore mentioning to Harry that his (Harry's) life was much more important than his own. Which tells me again that he would not be above sacrificing himself for the cause, especially to keep such a valuable asset as Snape inside the Lion's Den. Arguably though, now that Dumbledore is dead, and at Snapes hands, who exactly would Snape relay this important info to, seeing as now everyone in the story believes Snape has indeed defected. Unless of course Dumbledore trusted in the fact that regardless of whether Snape was able to transmit vital info or not, he would use his brains to tip the scales in favor of good, even though he is now seemingly on the outside.

Very tired, but that is my half awake take on Snapes' situation, I do believe in the end he will turn out to be a good man, though I do believe that he will always dislike just about everyone around him. Love is love though according to Dumbledore, and he believed that Snape must have had some down their somewhere, to have been able to trust him. As someone mentioned earlier, Dumbledore was no fool.

@neo, I notice an assload of typos, one in particular jumped out at me,

mishit

Now I don't think that is British slang or something like that, I just think it's a good old fashioned typo, the result of someone not paying attention, or just rushing themselves.

Thanks for whoever mentioned Regalus as a possibilty for the note in the locket. I was racking my brain trying to figure out if I had read the initials anywhere before, or if maybe they would ring a bell in a different order.

Though I would doubt this idea, simply for the fact that Dumbledore admitted he would not have been able to get the locket himself had there not been two of them there to retrieve it. Saying that Regalus was able to take the locket alone, is akin to saying that he was a greater wizard than Dumbledore, which even though we do not know much about Regalus, we know it is not possible for Regalus to be more powerful than Dumbledore was. Of course you could argue that he was not alone, but I am quite sure that he would not be able to find enough Death Eaters willing to desert Voldemort and help him steal the locket, and had he been helped by someone good, Dumbledore would have known this I would think.

Did I spell his name wrong everytime there? Tired again.

Lots of stuff.

Horcruxes, interesting things. JK will come up with something none of us would ever think of in a million years, but it is fun to speculate on what could possibly hold part of Voldemorts soul. To tell you the truth I haven't got the slightest clue as to what they could be hiding in. Though I do not think that Godric's Sword, is going to end up being one of them obviously. Like I said, she'll come up with something no one thought of, which makes it that much more fun.

JK was keen to keep the eye on the significance of the number 7 when speaking about Voldemort and his Horcruxes, though this might have been simple distraction to keep the mind somewhere else. Voldemort believes himself all powerful, so why would a magical number such as 7 have any weight to him, if he believes he's already beyond threat. Just a thought, this train of thought could lead to more Horcruxes than first thought, because regardless of the magical power of a number, common sense tells you that it would be much more wise to have made a Horcrux for each person you ever killed, because before Harry had time to find every last one, in order to kill Voldemort, he may very well have died of old age. This is assuming Voldemort feels that he is all powerful and beyond threat, which if he learned anything over these 6 years his eventual rule is anything but certain with Harry still in the picture.

Grawp patting hagrid on the head and sinking his chair legs into the ground, made tears well up in my eyes. And the fact that the Centaurs even paid their respects was simply a testament to the heart of the man they paid tribute to, and I love how JK portrays that, very simply, nothing overly complex like some authors tend to do, and yet it was played out perfectly, and couldn't have been better positioned to make you feel what they were feeling. This lady creates magic.

Edit: Did anyone else feel that when Dumbledore was crying out after drinking the potion from the Penseive like dish, that he thought something was his fault?

Page 572

"It's all my fault, all my fault," he sobbed. "Please make it stop, I know I did wrong, oh please make it stop and I'll never, never again..."

Does anyone else feel that this is in reference to the fact that he went to invite Tom/Voldemort to Hogwarts, and deep down inside blames himself for the way things are at present?

[Guest Lullaby]

Edit: Did anyone else feel that when Dumbledore was crying out after drinking the potion from the Penseive like dish, that he thought something was his fault?

Page 572

"It's all my fault, all my fault," he sobbed. "Please make it stop, I know I did wrong, oh please make it stop and I'll never, never again..."

Does anyone else feel that this is in reference to the fact that he went to invite Tom/Voldemort to Hogwarts, and deep down inside blames himself for the way things are at present?

That might just be what he was talking about. Of course there could be a number of things considering he's over 150 years old. That's a lot of years to make a lot of mistakes.

[Capt Snow]

Definitely agree with that, just thought, though that that might be one of his darkest fears, that he feels blame for Voldemort being as powerful as he is. I would think without the amount of schooling Voldemort had, he would have been much less potent than he is. Could be anything though. Thinking about it all is fun though.

[avadakedavra]

Definitely agree with that, just thought, though that that might be one of his darkest fears, that he feels blame for Voldemort being as powerful as he is. I would think without the amount of schooling Voldemort had, he would have been much less potent than he is. Could be anything though. Thinking about it all is fun though.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There's also a lot that Voldemort knows that he found out for himself. It's not like the ritual in the 4th book would have been common knowledge. Though Dumbledore has to blame himself a little for introducing Tom to the wizarding world.

You have to think, if he didn't get into magic, would he have used things the muggle way and maybe turned into the next Hitler?

[SchtoopingHer]

Because of all the snape discussion, figured I'd put this up. Scanned from latest Entertainment Weekly, so if anyone wants to pick the whole thing up, it has Harry on the cover (obviously).

All the scans can be found at danradcliffe.com. This is just a clip of one of the pages.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for posting that.

Makes for a very good debate, obviously.

EDIT: meaning theres alot for both sides to use . . . but I am sure JK intended it that way.

And thanks for getting my back, Capt Snow.

[SchtoopingHer]

SchtoopingHer: If you and I read the same book, where is all this "evidence and proof" coming from.

Sweet jesus, this is a childs book. All the "evidence" is coming from a made up story.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know its not a crime scene, and that there is no definite answer.

I've stated about fifty times on this board that these are my theories.

If you need to know the definition of that word, look it up in a dictionary.

And evidently I'm not the only one who's debating it, in case you missed the EW article.

And as far as "arguing", I've only argued about rudeness among posters, not the issue at hand.

Everything else was me debating my viewpoint, and letting people know what I was thinking, and how I was interpretting "clues" in the book . . . as everyone else on this board is doing.

Now, do you have anything besides that spiteful comment to contribute to this forum?

[pmech]

Now, do you have anything besides that spiteful comment to contribute to this forum?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I enjoyed the book thoroughly.

[SchtoopingHer]

Now, do you have anything besides that spiteful comment to contribute to this forum?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I enjoyed the book thoroughly.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No disagreement there.

Where do you guys rank it among the other novels?

Its so hard tom compare the first couple to the last several, i think.

That said, I think the major feeling I have about this book is that is was better than OOTP.

So, I guess my ranking would go:

1) POA

2) GOF

3) HBP

4) OOTP

5) SS

6) COS

Of course these are all varying levels of excellence in my mind, so there is no real "loser", i think.

[SchtoopingHer]

I don't know if this was mentioned in this forum, but on another site there are several who have pointed out that in OOTP, during a scene at the Black's house, The trio come across a "large locket that none of them could open".

Seems like some confirmation about the RAB theory.

[avadakedavra]

I don't know if this was mentioned in this forum, but on another site there are several who have pointed out that in OOTP, during a scene at the Black's house, The trio come across a "large locket that none of them could open".

Seems like some confirmation about the RAB theory.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It was. here

I've also been told that JKR confirmed that RAB was Regulus. I'll see if I can find the article.

[SchtoopingHer]

She did, basically.

During her interview with leaky cauldron and mugglenet.

[Capt Snow]

Still can't understand how he would pull it off alone, unless he switched it before Voldemort put it there, thus by passing all of the protection Voldemort put on it inside the cave.

[SchtoopingHer]

Still can't understand how he would pull it off alone . . . .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who said he did?

I have a feeling someone else was there ( perhaps a potions expert who left a trap waiting for volde?)

Just a wild guess, but i have a strong feeling he wasnt alone, since DD couldnt do it alone.

[alilandryfan]

Finally! A forum that doesn't mean I have to apply for passwords or post in certain areas to get my thoughts acrossed. lol I haven't had the chance to read everyone's take on the book but I have a few ideas. Firstly, I cried soooo hard when I read that Snape killed Dumbledore. I knew he had to die but it was that Snape killed him that I cried about. He's my absolute fave and I've always believed that no matter how much JK wants to build him up otherwise, he's a good guy. Although she has said to "not feel too sorry for Snape." Anyway, I have to say that "Snape vs Snape" article opened my mind to some new thoughts. I read it a few days ago and it dawned on me. I had been struck at how when Dumbledore saw Severus his first and only words were "Severus...please." If he, Dumbledore, thought Severus was on his side, why would his first words be a plea for his life? Unless as my friend said, she took it that Dumbledore was asking Snape to please help him cause of the potion he drank. Still, it struck me funny that if he was indeed begging for his life, that he would know that Snape was going to kill him in which case, why have him around?

Secondly, I found it funny that Snape was indeed giving Harry advice while Harry chased after him. Sure he threw spells his way but he never hurt him too bad and he told him over and over to "shut your mouth and open your mind" Something along those lines anyway. Unless Snape was so secure that Harry couldn't accomplish it, why tell him? Why give him more ammo to use? That stuck with me and I think it might be more proof he's a good guy.

Further proof? Upon listening to the book on cd after reading it, I remembered something. Harry knew Snape took an unbreakable vow. He knew it would kill him and assumingly, when the book says he told Dumbeldore everything, he told him about this. So that must mean that Dumbledore knew the obligation Severus was under and would he really let Snape just die? He knew Malfoy wouldn't go through with it as he told Malfoy. So that left Snape to do the job and I don't think he would have let him die. Especially with him being in the position he was in with Voldemort. And notice how when he ran, he kept Draco with him the whole time. I think it was to protect him. He knew the danger Draco would be in cause he didn't full fill his task. But did you notice how he didn't want to take that last part of the unbreakable vow? I think he only took it cause he would have looked iffy in front of Bellatrix had he not of and I think he was uneasy about the last part cause he knew he didn't want to help and it would have meant his life.

Now the only things that could derail this is that Snape and Dumbledore were over heard arguing. I understand Snape feeling like he was being over worked. I mean he's in a good position to help and it seems like he's always being asked to do more and it's a dangerous job. And I know people can argue that the second chapter showed what side he was on but I believe JK wanted us to see how he had to interact with the other half. We know how he is with the Order.

Also, my friend and I have drawn a conclusion. We think we really know why Snape feels bad about over hearing the prophecy and setting Voldemort off to the Potter's and why he might really be on their side. JK said a lot about Lily having a choice. I think that as a "reward" or "favor" to Snape for over hearing the prophecy, Voldemort allowed him a request and that was that he not kill Lily. I think Snape had feelings for her cause JK has hinted at this and said that Lily was "very popular" and "very liked". And Lily took up for Snape. But I think because she wouldn't move, Voldemort had to forget his promise to Severus and killed her. And I think when he found that out, it devestated him and he went to the good side. I think he hates Voldemort and I'll go a step further. I think Dumbledore knows that and he told Harry that Severus felt bad for killing James because he didn't think Harry or anyone would forgive him for Lily. He probably swore to keep that quiet. I think that's why Severus stays on the right side of things. I just wish he'd filled more people in on this so that everyone was stood sitting around hating Snape if this is the case. He has to have some morals. Dumbledore said in the first book that Severus saved Harry's life because he owed it to James for saving his life. If he had no morals, would he honor such a debt for a man that was already dead? No.

I think this was planned by the two of them to secure Snape to stay on the inside and Dumbeldore knew he could communicate with Harry in other ways. He has a picture hanging in the headmaster's office, right? And I think his brother is the person that JK wants to introduce us to more closely in the Order as she has said.

Anyway, that's my take. I think Draco would be on the good side if given the chance. He reverted back to being a child. He wanted to be an adult and have adult responsibilites so bad and when he got it, he choked. Oh and I'm plugging my site. lol I have a Hogwarts: The Early Years rpg. Feel free to join! http://www.freewebs.com/hpearlyears/index.htm

[SchtoopingHer]

Thanks for sharing you opinion, and welcome to the site.

I have spent almost all of my posts on this forum trying to support the same "snape is good" argument, so if you want to know some more about my theories (which you covered pretty well in your own rant) then check out my other posts in this forum.

And again, welcome to the site (its a good one, look around!)

[alilandryfan]

Firstly, how do I make my signature the right size? I was told it's too big and I don't know how to change the size without remaking the graphic and I don't want to do that! lol Anyway, SchtoopingHer, it scares me how much alike we think! I swear I hadn't read any of your posts when I posted mine so you can see we do think along the same lines. I have gone back and read a lot of your posts. I agree with so much fo what you said and you've even got me thinking deeper on a few things I had picked up myself. I really think that Snape was in love with Lily. As I have said, it was hinted by JK herself that even Lupin really liked her but would never compete with James for her. I know some people could argue that he did insult Lily but he was in a group of people. What was he supposed to say? I just wonder what has him against half-bloods so much when he himself is one? It could be that his father was a horrible person. I do remember that Harry got into Snape's mind or was it during the pencive? That he saw a memory of a small boy crying in the corner and a man (who looked a lot like Snape) was yelling at him. Harry said he thought it was a much younger Snape (ie the boy) but you never know, he could have interrupted it wrong. Maybe he had a lot of resentment toward muggles since then. However, I found a quote from an interview with JK I thought everyone should see.

MA: Oh, here

[Neo52285]

Firstly, how do I make my signature the right size? I was told it's too big and I don't know how to change the size without remaking the graphic and I don't want to do that!

check your PM...i fixed your sig and sent it to you

[SchtoopingHer]

Alilandryfan, you are right, we do think alike, as i immediately thought when i read your post!

On the subject of snape insulting Lilly, it seems to me that like most young people, he probably wouldnt have known how to express his feelings.

And moreso, the fact that Lilly was trying to stop James from tormenting Snape, could very well be a sign of her interest in James (she would have wanted him to be a good person, if she had feelings for him).

Perhaps Snape was very skilled at Occulemency (SP?) even at that age, and read her mind, or had read her mind before that scene, and was heart-broken or upset that she had feelings for James, instead of him. Thus when he insulted her, it was out of spite for the feelings he'd seen in her, and the way that made him feel.

Again, I think there is more to "Snape's Worst Memory" than a typical day of being bullied (i.e. everyone always talks about how snape was bullied relentlessly, so what made that day stand out?)

[alilandryfan]

ITA, SchtoopingHer. There has to be something deeper than just some school pranks. Snape would have to be a cold and bitter person to hold something so childish as some teasing back in school against James Potter, Sirius Black, and Remus Lupin for how many years? I don't understand his hate toward Lupin though. Sirius may not have kept him from Lily but he loved to tease Snape. However, Lupin seemed to keep his mouth shut and he even said in HBP that he neither hates or likes Severus.

Also, I know some people are saying how you have to really mean it to use Avada, but if Severus ever harbored any hate toward DD, any at all, I think he could have channeled it enough to have meant it when he killed him. Who is to say that the heated arguement wasn't a rooge to fire Snape up and to get him to have ill will toward DD? Bit of a stretch but it's a thought.

Also, I wanted to know your thoughts on Petunia. JK has said that "there is more to her than meets the eye." And she's not a squib. This is Harry's last time being with the Dursleys and I wonder if Aunt Petunia will finally be good to her sister. For the longest time I've felt she was jealous of Lily. Which is quite obvious. But I also thought that maybe she was so mean to Harry is cause like Snape, she resents him. She resents that her sister was a witch because maybe at one point they were close. Then suddenly they weren't and Lily died to save her son. It's obvious that Petunia knows more than what she lets onto. That's obvious from OOTP. She knew what dementors were and about Azkaban. Makes you wonder doesn't it? I'm just aching for Harry to finally get some form of parental love, even if he's past it. I teared up when Mrs. Weasley said that Harry was as good as her son in OOTP.

Also, does anyone else think that Lucious would sacrifice his own son to VD if he had to? I think Narcissa would turn her back on VD in a heart beat but I really think Lucious is so involved, he'd turn on his son if VD asked. I'd love to see more of Lucious and possibley see his own son but him in his place. They wouldn't be mixed up with VD in the first place if Lucious wasn't so set on being a death eater.

Just some random thoughts I'm tossing out there. Let me know what you think. Trying to spark some new train of thought. lol