MEN

[azgirl]

I am not exactly sure where to place this topic but I thought this is a good place for anyone who is like me that is just confused, frustrated, completely in love, completely in hate, has positive and negative things to say about men, or have no clue how to read men sometimes. This is not all about love and sex with the opposite sex but just thoughts someone may have about men. And it would be better to not use actual names if you are upset, though tempting to smoother an ex on the internet, its not really recommended.

And if men actually find themself in this topic.. please intervene if someone posts something you may want to address, but as the rules of the site state, no harrassing or flaming.

I'm just curious if others have the same thoughts as I do sometimes about the opposite sex.

[azgirl]

I wanted to voice my subject and hadn't found one to post this and I thought to make an entire subject about an important subject to some women..

What I may post first is kind of strong but I honestly have no idea why this happens to most men I know.

I do have an understanding of what may drive most men.. food, sex and entertainment (such as sports or video games) basic and understood.. but recently I have had issues with the emotional stuff. Who made the rule that men aren't supposed to voice or act their feelings? It isn't healthy not letting how feel out. I realize women are known to be more "emotional" but I know men can feel; why can't most men show it?

My thoughts right now are based on a guy getting upset with me simply because he would not express his feelings .. I admit I may have teased to ask about what he was feeling at the moment because he wouldn't say but he left the conversation and I bet he won't even say he was angry. I don't get it why can't a guy cry, or be sad about something? letting it out allows less angry outbursts. Wouldn't it? Maybe I am wrong

[azgirl]

OH My..

You are right about the family unit but unfortunately not all men have the values to be the "rock or cornerstone". I have gotten to know quite a few men in a friendship manner and you would be surprise how many men really want to let some of the bottling stuff out.. and its strange that it seems to be hard to do for some men even to someone they trust and love... letting go to a wife, for instance, is one of the steps of saving most marriages, but it seems to be really hard for some men.. even women can get too busy to let their husbands in sometimes..

i feel for your dad, its hard to loose a parent, but I bet he had his support.. your mom. What is shown in society is unhealthy to what is shown in private, or at least should be shown in private. I have come to find some people have a hard time seperating what is private to what is social.

I completely understand beer in one hand, remote in the other, watching TV while the woman services the man.. but then usually the man wakes up .. lol

With the way society is changing, this scene may now be something a woman may want now .. hehehe .. and the humorous part ... she may even want the woman servicing her..

I am not someone who is to into the woman's feminist movement.. actually I think it has made more work for the female .. now we work a full time job and are still expected to do all of the "duties required as a woman"; which is now more than twice the work of a man .. I am not sure how that helped us.

i still find what was thought to be the women's duties in 1955 to be hilarious, were they serious? lol

[mbinebri]

now we work a full time job and are still expected to do all of the "duties required as a woman"; which is now more than twice the work of a man ..

Now that's a bit of a sexist statement!

What are the duties required as a woman exactly? Cooking dinner? Raising the kids? Cleaning the house? If you believe these tasks are still the sole duty of women, then you're just as much a victim of accepting sexist societal norms as the men who deny their emotions, of whom you criticize!

And I mostly agree with red_ed: society has always said men have to be stoic. Just think about what the adjective "masculine" implies: strong, brave, proud, dominant/aggressive, sexual, a leader, etc. Nowhere will you see it including sensitive, emotional, and open -- those are classic characteristics of femininity, for better or worse, and women too are trained to evaluate men by the classic masculine traits, which only makes it even less likely men will change.

[azgirl]

now we work a full time job and are still expected to do all of the "duties required as a woman"; which is now more than twice the work of a man ..

Now that's a bit of a sexist statement!

What are the duties required as a woman exactly? Cooking dinner? Raising the kids? Cleaning the house? If you believe these tasks are still the sole duty of women, then you're just as much a victim of accepting sexist societal norms as the men who deny their emotions, of whom you criticize!

And I mostly agree with red_ed: society has always said men have to be stoic. Just think about what the adjective "masculine" implies: strong, brave, proud, dominant/aggressive, sexual, a leader, etc. Nowhere will you see it including sensitive, emotional, and open -- those are classic characteristics of femininity, for better or worse, and women too are trained to evaluate men by the classic masculine traits, which only makes it even less likely men will change.

Ok reading that statement may make it sound a little sexist.. but it is true in a lot of parts.. like you guys are talking about society... this society pro quo has women running the household while the man are to be the main provider and "leader" .. lol.. what a joke.. I hope this does change faster than it is.. there are a few men stepping up and helping the wife or mother .. or even taking over as a single dad.. but OMG .. it is a slow change.. I can not tell you how many men I know that the wife is their backbone and strength. Which usually translates into they work a full time job and come home and take care of their husband and the house. and a man that does a lot fo rhis wife seems to be label "pussy whipped" .. the change is not here yet mb guy.

I know I am sounding a little sexist but I am not .. I try to figure look at things and see how they work.. and the one thing that can be confusing at times is men.

And I do have positive things to say about the "masculine" gender, when the more men get in touch with both their masculine and feminine sides.. they tend to become really good lovers and companions. Not that I would know anything about that of course.. and one thing I do know when a woman can also be in touch with both sides, guys can be really fun to hang out with.

[red_ed]

Ok reading that statement may make it sound a little sexist.. but it is true in a lot of parts.. like you guys are talking about society... this society pro quo has women running the household while the man are to be the main provider and "leader" .. lol.. what a joke.. I hope this does change faster than it is.. there are a few men stepping up and helping the wife or mother .. or even taking over as a single dad.. but OMG .. it is a slow change.. I can not tell you how many men I know that the wife is their backbone and strength. Which usually translates into they work a full time job and come home and take care of their husband and the house. and a man that does a lot fo rhis wife seems to be label "pussy whipped" .. the change is not here yet mb guy.

[azgirl]

Ok reading that statement may make it sound a little sexist.. but it is true in a lot of parts.. like you guys are talking about society... this society pro quo has women running the household while the man are to be the main provider and "leader" .. lol.. what a joke.. I hope this does change faster than it is.. there are a few men stepping up and helping the wife or mother .. or even taking over as a single dad.. but OMG .. it is a slow change.. I can not tell you how many men I know that the wife is their backbone and strength. Which usually translates into they work a full time job and come home and take care of their husband and the house. and a man that does a lot fo rhis wife seems to be label "pussy whipped" .. the change is not here yet mb guy.

I think there is more acceptance of the male role within the household nowadays, and indeed many household duties are shared now along with the workload, though I do believe the attitude that women should know about or do more of the household duties than the men still remains. This is probably in part due to the attitudes that were taught somewhat recently, and even some of our parents grew up believing these values. I believe it was only relatively recently (late 70s to 80s??) that these attitudes were challenged by a substantial proportion of society. You cannot expect these attitudes to be changed in one generation, but at least things a improving right?

On a side note, the number of women (in metropolitan Sydney at least) giving up on their careers and becoming F/T housewives after they have children is increasing. Take that with a pinch of salt though.

I try to figure look at things and see how they work..

[red_ed]

Not sure what that last statement was.. most likely a thought changed mid sentence.. lol

[mbinebri]

I don't watch Heroes. I watch the History Channel.

If things are changing for women, why isn't it changing for men?

[irenistiQ]

i thinQ washing undies is also a part of the women's duties.

[azgirl]

i thinQ washing undies is also a part of the women's duties.

[azgirl]

Not sure what that last statement was.. most likely a thought changed mid sentence.. lol

It made sense, but to understand my reply you must watch Heroes. Do you watch Heroes?

your right about not changing things so quickly but my point is the sex revolution actually only made more necessity for "super mom or wife" It sucks.. but this whole thing really stated with the subject of men.. how did it become women?

[azgirl]

I don't watch Heroes. I watch the History Channel.

If things are changing for women, why isn't it changing for men?

Because we've been living in a patriarchal society and it's the perception that women are inferior to men that requires the greatest amount of current change.

[red_ed]

I don't watch Heroes. I watch the History Channel.

[red_ed]

I haven't watched Heros since the first season so no I haven't been watching it. Sorry.

[azgirl]

What I don't understand is, on one hand, I read that you know it will take a long time to completely change an idea that has been around for the better part of human history. On the other, you are complaining about the pace of change while at the same time acknowledging that the change has only come about in recent times? Nevertheless, it is good to see that you are trying to change that You could start by forcing your partner to enrol in a home economics course

[azgirl]

yes I have friends that are in touch with both sides but did I mention most are bi sexual or gay. SO do you want to touch this one?

I have guy friends who are really cool guys but so MAN by society standards. It is sad because to me I see how much happier my friends that let things out are in comparison. That is why I don't understand.. well that and I seem to hit a huge barrier with a friend lately.. he is soo difficult when it comes to not letting his emotions out. and he doesn't realize it effects his mood.. I do not like trying to have fun pissy pants.

Don't push it with the guys imo. Men tend to become more reclusive when they have to deal with emotional problems. A good example of this is someone I knew who witnessed a suicide when he was working. He was at the scene and saw the person jump off a building and land on a car. He (along with every other guy there) refused the counselling provided. Instead, he switched off his mobile for a week so no one could find him. I guess it was his way of coping with it Personally, I prefer spitting things out and I encourage my friends to do so but they don't either I guess its just about whether or not a guy is comfortable enough to do it... you'd probably be more likely to discuss things with him if you two were alone.

[red_ed]

My opinion may seem all over the place because when i look at things it is like looking 3D I guess.. i see all sides and try to get some empathy.

And I complain because I am one of the expected "super moms" with no partner at the moment.. actually for far too many moments.. but that is another subject.

Oh and BTW you can't force anyone to do anything unless it pleases them.. hehehe

Getting all sides to the story is fine, but I was just trying to highlight the contradiction of knowing that it will take a long time to change, but still complaining about it not changing

so you're a supermom with no partner, or a supermom in the making?

I am alone when I talk to him.. he is seems to be so far from his emotions, which is sad because he is not a happy person because of it. And it sucks when something happens and he gets all distant.. it makes him do things I know he wouldn't if he let go of everything he felt.

And I am glad you release things .. i bet you don't feel like you have the weight of the world on your shoulders.

I was under the impression he was unable to express his emotion in a healthy manner, but from what you wrote above it now seems he is just not in touch with his emotions How does it affect his behaviour, if you don't mind me asking? Have you tried bringing it to his attention?

I used to bottle up too and it was very painful, but then I saw the light and now I can't stop bitching to anything or anyone that is willing to listen

[Kevork89]

Im going to be very honest here about myself as a male and other males around me. First off im 19 and i am straight. The one thing that upsets me is that people presume i am gay or weird because of the way i act or am intune with my emotions. In general when it comes to talking about my emotions i am closed off but when i want to cry i cry. When im feeling down or sad i let it out. When it comes to being a real mans man thats not me. I actually try and avoid the stereotype of being a male. Not that i want to be a woman no i love being who i am but i dont like to conform.

My whole life ive been different to all other males around me. Growing up i hung out with girls and in all honesty i bitch and gossip like alot of girls do. At the moment my two best friends and basically my only friends are female. Because of that and how i am people presume things about me. I dont care they can think what they want because i know who i am. In relation to the topics you are discusiing, i hate that men have to be guarded and stoic. Its terrible. The way myself and my two older brothers were raised are different to how others around us were. Our father cleans, cooks and raised us just as much as our mother did. He taught me that i dont have to be a tough bread winner he told me its ok to cry and feel emotion.

I think thats a great thing...I believe that men can be stay at home dads or work in fashion and do what they want and not have to be labelled because thats how society sees it. I love women and when people first meet me one question that always pops up is are you gay? Like i said people presume what they want but i know who i am.