January 2, 20196 yr 50 minutes ago, Enrico_sw said: I said (and you quoted it): "maths fails to completely explain" which does not mean the same as "maths completely fails...". It's just not the same at all. Be fair and don't call it "semantics" again, the two sentences have nothing to do with each other. Mine means that maths doesn't explain everything, which is true. Complex ratios and their consonance/dissonance can't be explained by maths. There are people who spend years of research on it, it's not trivial. Oooh I read that wrong. My apologies on that one. 51 minutes ago, Enrico_sw said: @Stormbringer This is supposed to be a discussion, even if it's a lively one. I don't get why it should become dismissive. I'm annoyed by a lot of post modernists (in painting, music...) who are bourgeois who defend political views above a lot of things. That did not target you, you have the right to like what you want, and, I have the right to like what I want. I've never argued about liking that stuff or not. All I'm doing is to point the fact that it remains being music and those who make it are real musicians. 57 minutes ago, Enrico_sw said: but that doesn't mean "the tritone is the basis of the tonal system" Yeah, don't twist my words. I said: On 12/13/2018 at 9:47 PM, Stormbringer said: The tritone btw is pretty much the basis of the tonal system. Which I rounded with: 3 hours ago, Stormbringer said: The tonal system is based on the major scale, the tritone that this scale has and the Dominant chord that contains it. The tonal system is based on tension and resolution and that tension in provided by the tritone that appears on the Dominant chord. Those are the basics of the tonal system: the Major scale, tritone found in the dominant chord and the V7 -> I resolution. Everything else comes as a consequence of this and as an add on to these basic aspects. I don't know how bringing the circle of fifths changes any of this. 1 hour ago, Enrico_sw said: Still not proving it... The music proves it itself. And... 3 hours ago, Stormbringer said: Also, Schoenberg was one of Mahler's students. He learned directly from him. "Mahler was the source of the Second Viennese School" You're denial on this is like saying that Oasis has no Beatles influence. Or that Judas Priest has no Queen influence. Or that Steve Vai took no influence from Satriani or Zappa... The point here is: no music comes out of nowhere. Not even the weirdest atonal and serial stuff.. And I still don't understand why it seems to "hurt" (for the lack of a better word) you so much that the likes of Mahler, Wagner, Strauss, etc are important influences for composers as Schoenberg, Webern, Boulez, etc
January 3, 20196 yr Let's praise John Paul Jones and his sick bass line for this song on his birthday
January 3, 20196 yr Another amazing bass line which links them to the Professor J.R.R. Tolkien who would also be celebrating his birthday today
January 5, 20196 yr On 1/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, Stormbringer said: Oooh I read that wrong. My apologies on that one. On 1/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, Stormbringer said: Yeah, don't twist my words. I said: On 12/14/2018 at 1:47 AM, Stormbringer said: The tritone btw is pretty much the basis of the tonal system. Alright, fair enough, let's stop arguing on this. That wasn't the heart of the argument anyway (and there has probably never been any real disagreement between us on this ) On 1/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, Stormbringer said: And I still don't understand why it seems to "hurt" (for the lack of a better word) you so much that the likes of Mahler, Wagner, Strauss, etc are important influences for composers as Schoenberg, Webern, Boulez, etc I doesn't hurt. It's just that I think that Mahler (and Wagner and Strauss!) are geniuses, whereas I strongly dislike Schönberg & friends (and I've just used my nicest words to express this ) On 1/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, Stormbringer said: "Mahler was the source of the Second Viennese School" Well, that's what he claims. I'd love to hear what Mahler would think about it if he wasn't six feet under the ground... On 1/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, Stormbringer said: You're denial on this is like saying that Oasis has no Beatles influence. Or that Judas Priest has no Queen influence. Or that Steve Vai took no influence from Satriani or Zappa... Hmmm.... the influence is much clearer with these guys! As far as I'm concerned, I agree with all the examples you mentionned (except... Mahler and the atonal guys). Honestly (and I really try to be honest), I don't see concrete examples of this influence (I can't see it, in the melody, in the harmony, in the rhythm... I just can't see it, and I know they claim it, but that's no proof). Mahler plays with rare and well chosen surprises. Boulez is just random wild with everything (melody, harmony, rhythm...) at the same time; the "surprises" are the norm, so they aren't surprises anymore. -------- I'll try to bring another argument: I don't claim to be a perfect musician, but when I listen to Mahler, I can remember what I hear and I can transcribe it (maybe not perfectly, maybe not on the first try, but still it's doable, more or less easily, depending on the complexity of the piece). On the other hand, I can't do anything with Boulez' pieces, like this one: Spoiler I can't remember it. I can't even start to play it in my head after hearing it. Even if I just listen to the first couple of measures, I can't remember it (and I bet few people can - I'm not even sure that they can do it themselves). The French musician I quoted (a couple of weeks ago) introduced false notes in an atonal piece and nobody could hear the difference.
January 5, 20196 yr Honey Lantree, who has died aged 75, achieved the unique feat of being the first woman drummer in a pop group to top the British charts as a member of the group the Honeycombs, whose single Have I the Right, a classic of the beat group era, produced by Joe Meek, reached Number One in 1964. While there were any number of young female singers flourishing in the early 1960s, among them Dusty Springfield and Lulu, beat groups of the day were a strictly a male preserve, and the novelty of the attractive, smiling figure of Honey Lantree, in fashionable beehive hairdo, seated behind a drum kit, was a potent tool for promoting the group in television appearances and newspaper and magazine articles. Such were the chauvinist attitudes of the day that many queried whether Honey Lantree had actually played on the record at all. “People looked on it as a gimmick,” she once recalled, “but I played on every single track we recorded.” The Telegraph, London.
January 6, 20196 yr Coming soon in 2019! The gang teams up to stop an asteroid from destroying the Earth. Featuring a new song from Axl Rose of Guns N' Roses, his first in over 10 years!
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