The Avengers, Age of Ultron, Infinity War & Endgame (2012-2019)

[jkjk]

^  Avatar was certainly much better on the big screen in 3D. The only movie I put in a similar category is Gravity. Neither are the same when seen in other formats. I have never thought of it before but I wonder if that's why 3D has not been used as effectively by others? (it's a better excuse than ineptitude )

 

Also, I like Zoe and she should definitely do that.  

[Cult Icon]

Avatar was insanely expensive to produce and market-  It was one of the most expensive films ever made at that time.

[jkjk]

^  That's a theme with James Cameron. It was a similar situation with Titanic.

[Michael*]

I'm given to understand as well that the budget for the Avatar sequels will be over a billion, dwarfing that of Infinity War and Endgame. So much like the first one, it could be the greatest triumph or disaster in Hollywood history. That seems to be the way Cameron likes it, though. 

[Matt!]

 

[Michael*]

Thanks to audiences in China going out to see the film in droves this weekend, I'm given to understanding that Avatar has once again taken over as the most successful movie ever. It's like Scientology I suppose, only instead of Scientologists buying "Dianetics" to put it back on the best seller list, it's your aunt going to the cinema to push Avatar back to the top.

[jkjk]

Now that the same company owns the two films, it no longer makes much sense for a fight over #1. Of course, it didn't make a lot of sense before when the two films were owned by different companies.

[Michael*]

13 hours ago, jkjk said:

Now that the same company owns the two films, it no longer makes much sense for a fight over #1. Of course, it didn't make a lot of sense before when the two films were owned by different companies.

 

Honestly, if I were some scheming Disney supervillain (and no one here can prove that I'm not), I might now do an American re-release of Endgame in July to test the public's appetite for going back into cinemas, while counting on MCU diehards to push it back into first place. Then, re-re-release Avatar in September to both advertise the sequel and take over again at the top.

 

They could probably squeeze an extra £150m out of people over the next few years by simply going back and forth.

[jkjk]

^^  Not the worst idea, making money without spending much to do so. Would a scheming Disney supervillain reveal the plan, though?  

[Michael*]

14 hours ago, jkjk said:

Would a scheming Disney supervillain reveal the plan, though?  

 

It might be safe here, away from the prying eyes of Viacom CBS. 

[Cult Icon]

After the Synder cut and looking back it really seems that the generic "Iron Man"- and the Marvel formula-  turned out to be the winner in the Superhero wars.   Iron Man was nowhere as good as the Nolan films but this safe approach/template became a colossal success.

 

The more risky paths taken by Synderverse / dark adult path Nolan films didn't pan out as well.  Back in 2008 this was far from certain.

[Michael*]

14 hours ago, Cult Icon said:

After the Synder cut and looking back it really seems that the generic "Iron Man"- and the Marvel formula-  turned out to be the winner in the Superhero wars.   Iron Man was nowhere as good as the Nolan films but this safe approach/template became a colossal success.

 

The more risky paths taken by Synderverse / dark adult path Nolan films didn't pan out as well.  Back in 2008 this was far from certain.

 

I suppose you'd have to say it wasn't really until 2012 that successful MCU releases were taken for granted. Beforehand, I think it was mainly the performances of Downey that elevated the project and carried it towards a breakout moment with the arrival of the first big crossover showpiece.

 

Consequently though, the later Marvel movies feel weightier and more emotional than they otherwise might have because of what's gone before, which in turn helps them to feel like better movies. Even when you watch one of the weaker entries, it's like a filler episode of a TV show you care about, which is a neat trick because the good stuff smooths out the parts that are undeniably a bit rougher.

 

With DC, while I guess it's more a case of peaks and troughs, what worked best (Nolan's trilogy of course being the high point) always felt like the stuff that had little or nothing to do with the extended universe, so it was a pity when they became obsessed with trying to force their own Avengers. Rather than organically building up to it however, they starting giving us things like the inclusion of Wonder Woman when they hadn't spent enough time exploring the values of their established leads, and the resurrection of Superman when he'd only been dead for an hour's worth of screen time.

 

Miring itself in the "New 52" influence, which the layman would probably struggle to recognise as Batman or Superman, didn't do much to help things either.

[Cult Icon]

On 3/29/2021 at 6:58 AM, Michael* said:

Consequently though, the later Marvel movies feel weightier and more emotional than they otherwise might have because of what's gone before, which in turn helps them to feel like better movies. Even when you watch one of the weaker entries, it's like a filler episode of a TV show you care about, which is a neat trick because the good stuff smooths out the parts that are undeniably a bit rougher.

 

With DC, while I guess it's more a case of peaks and troughs, what worked best (Nolan's trilogy of course being the high point) always felt like the stuff that had little or nothing to do with the extended universe, so it was a pity when they became obsessed with trying to force their own Avengers. Rather than organically building up to it however, they starting giving us things like the inclusion of Wonder Woman when they hadn't spent enough time exploring the values of their established leads, and the resurrection of Superman when he'd only been dead for an hour's worth of screen time.

 

 

The impression I've gotten from watching the first wave of Marvel films is that they are intentionally choosing a safe and profitable template from the get go and their universe is much more unified/reinforcing.  They don't take big risks, lower complexity, and they make their films inoffensive.  This reminds me of their comics and the Disney/Pixar approach. The Marvel ones are closer to the way they are presented in the comics. 

 

DC was mismanaged. I wished they kept going on the Nolan route.  Man of Steel was supposed to be a continuation of that but they changed course. 

 

I haven't been following since Endgame but what's next?

[Michael*]

On 3/30/2021 at 6:30 PM, Cult Icon said:

The impression I've gotten from watching the first wave of Marvel films is that they are intentionally choosing a safe and profitable template from the get go and their universe is much more unified/reinforcing.  They don't take big risks, lower complexity, and they make their films inoffensive.  This reminds me of their comics and the Disney/Pixar approach. The Marvel ones are closer to the way they are presented in the comics. 

 

DC was mismanaged. I wished they kept going on the Nolan route.  Man of Steel was supposed to be a continuation of that but they changed course. 

 

Yeah, the earlier stuff undoubtedly takes a fairly "by the book" approach to the genre. Iron Man for example was a rather conventional film, albeit with a lot of energy and the charisma of Downey to help it power through some of its issues. The later MCU entries, which broadly speaking are my favourites, blur the lines between genres a little more (not that there's anything wrong with "something explodes and the hero says something funny," I've just seen it done to death). Still, I do find it interesting to note how disparate the rankings seem to be for different fans, I think that speaks to the way Marvel has managed to construct a universe that impacts so personally and so directly to such a big audience.

 

The sad thing with DC is, I really think even a Justice League movie right out of the gate and without any buildup whatsoever could have been made to work. There'll always be a market for spectacle, as long as your characters look enough like their comic book counterparts and behave in ways that people expect, it's relatively easy to get right.

[Michael*]

On 3/30/2021 at 6:30 PM, Cult Icon said:

I haven't been following since Endgame but what's next?

 

The MCU basically taking 2020 off made Endgame feel more like an actual ending (with Spider-Man: Far From Home as a coda), which did make me wonder how many people might view it that way and kind of stop paying attention. In fairness though the Disney+ shows appear to be doing well, so it looks like the demand is still there. There's the Black Widow movie to come too, which I'm looking forward to more now than when it was first announced. I don't know if that's simply down to a general scarcity of content, but I do quite like that it seemingly represents a shift from MCU continuity into perhaps more self-contained stories.

[TheDude2k]

Marvel Cinematic Universe 4K Blu-ray film montages